I gave you examples of nuclear-armed nations going kinetic without going nuclear, then you countered by stating that it's apples-to-oranges with Ukraine vis-a-vis Russia. I agree. Not the same at all. Ukraine doesn't have nukes. Maybe don't compare nuclear vs nuclear nation conflicts to nuclear vs non-nuclear nation conflict I guess? Like, what's Ukraine going to escalate to? We were talking about US v Russia *within* the context of the Ukraine fight remember? That's nuclear power vs nuclear power. Ukraine vs Russia is not.